I have an Idea.

[Rallyray]

I was thinking long and Hrad the other night about the unfortunate incident a fortnight ago.

What would it cost to give every road closure a Fire Extinguisher in event of an Accident like thi shappening again. Seen the BMSC have plently of money in the bank it would be a one off cost. Is it some how that they can claim some of it back?

If an accident did happen and lets say two canisters were used it the cost of refilling should be funded by the unfortunate driver.

At least it shortens the gap of fire progreesing till the other driver arrive at the scene.

Most drivers know (or should!!!) how to use a fire extinguisher therefore the risk of mispray is limited.

Ok some fires can not be put out in time But I personlly would rather trying all possible resorts to deal with the fire and not be stuck wondering that the fire couyld have been put out if only I had one more Canister.

What do people think?

[Daniel]

Not a bad idea Ray but I think it'd be hard to keep track of them and they'ed end up going walkies. For my part I think I'm going to install a plumbed in system like the one Tim was suggesting - $350 as opposed to losing an entire car? - not much of a choise really, the weights the bit that gets to me, those things are bloody heavy!! - I'll have to cut some metal out of somewhere --"Now where did I leave that drill again"

[fro]

Ray, it's a good idea, but I just don't think that it's feasible...for a couple of reasons.

Cost is expensive. It would be pricey, and the amount of fire you'd be able to extinguish with a small extinguisher would be negligible. If you went for big ones, the cost would just jack up even more.

The usefullness of having them would be not that much greater than what they are now inside the cars. I was the controllie dealing with the situation on that fateful night, and I don't think a fire extinguisher would've helped much at all......By the time Neil came running down the road telling us the ca was on fire, it was well and truly on fire. the only way I think you would've got it out by then was with a fire tanker.

If the hypothetical accident happened right next to a road closure, then it might be of use, but otherwise, it would probably be insignificant in its assistance. And Murphy's Law says that if an accident is going to happen, it will happen just far enough away to make assistance futile.

The cost of maintenance would be recognisable (recharging, tagging, etc), as well as the massive pain in the ass of making sure that they were all looked after, and gotten back after every event!

I went to the forum with Garry Connelly and NSW Rally Panel earlier in the year, and GC as good as admitted that even fire-bombs won't put out a car (evidence:SWRT fires earlier in the year). They're not designed to put out a serious in-car fire. They are designed to buy the crew time to get out of the car.

I feel bad for Neil and Julie, but I don't think there is much that anyone could've done after that fire caught hold. But if we keep looking for other ways to make the sport safer (like you are), then hopefully we'll get there...

[fro]

Apart from WRC and Roedigers, when was the last fire in rallying that anyone can remember?

And when was the last one that burnt a car to the graound (ala Roedigers). I'm just trying to figure out the likelihood of it happening again, before I dismiss the chances as "<i>remote</i>"...

[Daniel]

Fro, with the amount of turbo cars around I think the chances will unfortunatly rise rather then fall - a good idea would be to design the heatsheilds around a turbo to stop oil/fuel from dripping on the turbo in a rollover situation (just an idea). (these are cool!!)

[fro]

Yeah, just another reason not to have one That, and the fact that I could buy one if I sold my house.......and both my kidneys. Well, OK, all three of my kidneys...

Seriously though, I think that you're right. The chances of underbonnet fires is going to go up, and with that, the cost to us for insurance, licencing, etc....

It's the sport we love....isn't it

[Rallyray]

We were to get sponser ship from Chubb etc.. Would they be interested in a sticker on the side of each car for a "loan" of extinguishers which would be returned paying the cost in one was used.

I know its a bit Far Out but we need to do something, I would hate to see this happen again or worse, someone losing their life

[raybak]

Maybe it would be easier to give a donation to the Bush Fire Brigade to have their trucks at the start of say every second stage. Or if there was a really long stage maybe they could be situated at a mid point where they can also spectate.

Seeing as we don't have too many rallies in summer this would be a good chance for the Fire Fighter volunteers to get some training and familiarisation with their fire fighting equipment.

Maybe we could mention in the supp regs for an event that we are proudly suppported by XXX fire brigade. This way they also get some recognition.

Just a thought

Ray

[fro]

My main concern (and I think everybodies, really) is safety. I'd like to see Fire Brigade (Bushfiries, or ACT) in a central location for the rally, on standby. For the Wizard, somewhere like Uriarra would be a good place to be situated...

The firies the other weekend were a lot from in town, so the took <b><i>forever</i></b> to come out to the scene, and then at a meeting the week after, they told people that they thought they were just being called out to an abandoned wreck that someone had torched!

'Course, the problem with all these fangled ideas, is that they cost money, that will force entry fees up. And once you set the precedent (not that it's a bad thing), it's hard to take a backward step, particularly when others (ACT Gov.) hear about it. They then expect every event, from the Dell through to RoC to comply with it.

But having said that, I think the support of a local bushfire crew would be great. Maybe a donation for each event would get them on side. They could even treat it as a practice/training day! And I'm sure we could donate some Aussie Currency (VB) to them at the end of the day.....

Fire extinguishers every RC might be raising the bar a little bit high.....Good idea though....

[MadDog]

I have been out fighting fires on and off since Saturday, I have been talking to the crews, there was an overall positive responce to being involved with rallys, I would suggest getting say 4 light units, place them at strategic points throughout the rally, with one following the sweep car.
If food is supplied and a small donation made to the cause I am sur everyone will be happy.


Daniel, the extinguishing system I was refering to is very very small, maybee 2kg max. so weight would not be an issue.

Cheers

Tim

[Daniel]

Did.......did you just say what I think you said 2kg not much?? Here I am cutting mg out of the car and your trying to tell me 2Kg ain't much .........someone catch me I'm going to faint In all seriousness I thought they where heavier then that - I'll have to catch up with you and see whats avalable.

As for the FireBrigade stuff, we have to be carfull we don't dig ourselves into a hole - Fro's right about the setting a precedent stuff - Urban Services and the Police can be real difficult to please.

But hey who says we have to tell them that we have a fire unit in attendance right? they where just out for a drive and happend to hang round :

[MadDog]

Daniel,

with rallys out of fire season, organisation can be done at the brigade level, which means it can be kept pretty informal, but during summer all units have to be accounted for at all times.

If your worried about 2kg, I suggest Jenny craig may be the answer (

Cheers

Tim

[jamar]

Howdy Guys,

Maybe the way to go would be for the club to look at purchasing a small ex brigade vehicle, for the summer months .. surely there would be something around that wouldn't be too expensive.

in addition there could be series points for the volunteers (trained of course), similar to what's offered for officials.

x points for training with the fire brigade
x points for volunteering for a rally

what do ya think ???

Cheers

[Daniel]

Thats an idea - the fire'ies near Tumbarumba have a little trailer mounted jobby stationed on our farm, I wonder what their worth second hand?

Could get recovery to tow it out to a service park or somfin.

By the way Tim I have thought about it but I like real food - Hamburgers, chips, chocholate bars - you know a working mans staple diet

[MadDog]

Daniel,

I have just recieved info on a new (very simple) on board extinguishing system , go have a look at http://www.firetrace.com/


Cheers

Tim