ARC "control tyre" IDEA

[legend]

after watching bathurst on the weekend I reckon If i was a tyre Manufacturer and the promoters of any series wanted to use a control tyre, I'd run a mile.

Take bathurst as an example. everyone is using Dunlops, so there's never any suggestion made that dunlop is a superior tyre. But when they start delaminating, all of a sudden there is a possible problem with these batch of Dunlops. There's always excuses about debris on the track or whatever, but the implication is (to the viewer) that there has been a lot of dodgy dunlops around.

Its the reason Renault pulled out of F1 for many years. the williams won a lot, except when their renault engines failed.

[flat04]

But Bathurst had good close racing all day with any of the front 6 or more cars having a chance of winning for most of the day. Is that aided by having a control tyre?? I think so, even the back markers were doing some pretty reasonable times.

Why should Rallycorp take any money from the prefered tyre supplier if a control tyre is introduced? Shouldn't all the money go back into making the tyres themselves cheaper? Sounds like corruption to me. If the share holders believe that they can make the most profit is by increasing running costs and taking "bribes" then the ARC is stuffed. They should be working towards having 30+ competitve ARC registered cars. That is how Rallycorp would make the most money.

I was hoping the control tyre would be a positive but it now looks like the wrong questions were asked in the survey to enable a dodgy deal to be done.

Bugger!!

[MikeW]

Steve,

Just to remind you of what Rallycorp are supposed to be doing:

Rallycorp Pty. Ltd. is the company that has been licensed by the Australian Motor Sports Commission (AMSC), the commercial arm of the Confederation of Australian Motorport (CAMS), to promote and develop the commercial rights of the Australian Rally Championship.

Rallycorp was formed in 1999 with the prime objective of commercialising and growing the Australian Rally Championship through:

sponsorship
merchandise
internet
television
corporate hospitality

Rallycorp seeks to exercise its commercial rights in a manner that will:

Enhance the image and value of the ARC
Explore all available revenue sources, but particularly sources other than those related to existing competitors and organisers
Create an image for the ARC which is modern, dynamic and easily recognisable
Ensure the ARC maintains a strong and popular image for quality and safety
Value the sponsors and other stakeholders of the ARC, the competitors and the organisers
Achieve a high common level of event organisation and imaging
Increase the media coverage of the ARC

I'd also suggest that on-line polls on rally magazine websites are not the best way to do research in this area. I don't recall the V8's, the WRC or F1 using this approach when they made their decisions to go down the control tyre routes.

The other question I have is - Given they have been around for 8 years, can Rallycorp show me how they have grown the Australian Rally Championship? How many more sponsors are there now? What extra merchandise is available and what are the sales like? How has the internet coverage been improved, how does it compare to other websites like the WRC, V8's or BRCC for instance? How has the TV coverage changed from 1999 to now? etc etc You've had 8 years afterall......

It might also be worth pointing out that Mr Ashton has a 37% stake in Rallycorp according to the rally.com.au website.

[Ric Cary]

Originally Posted by tortfeaser

Whatever the specifics of this particular issue (and its a very interesting one) the processes that have been used are an abomination.

and from that could we assume that the processes used for other negotiated " deals" are or were also an abomination?

Originally Posted by tort

My overwhelming feeling is that Ed is cutting and running before really getting going in the job. And now he has decided to do so, is letting off hand grenades totally unresponsibly. And kind of whining as he goes about it. They did this, blah blah blah. It was in his remit to sort it and he couldn't get it done.

Couldn't get it done or was not allowed the required freedoms to get it done 2 very different scenarios

Originally Posted by Tort

And what has been the result for this particular issue? ARCom/ARCWG don't know what potential deal could be done (and it could have been beneficial for competitors, the market has not been tested), we've got an incomplete/doubtful process for determining competitor views on the issue. We've not got any idea what regulatory framework would be put around a control tyre. And we've got no clear way forward to sort out the unknowns.

That I think tort is the whole issue it was produced as a done deal

Originally Posted by Tort

As to the GLR thing, why would ARCom get the Stewards' report? And Ed should know the Observer's report can take longer than this to come about. Why hasn't he got on the phone to Michelle Gatton if he's after it? Again, there are real issues to be addressed. Ed's solution is to have a whine and fail to offer any way forward to consider these issues.

Why wouldn't or shouldn't ARCOM recieve the Stewards and Observers reports especially from an event with so many issues I don't know that Eds reply could be regarded as a whine at all more a clear and concise outline of the events

[Ric Cary]

Originally Posted by MikeW

Steve,

Just to remind you of what Rallycorp are supposed to be doing:



I'd also suggest that on-line polls on rally magazine websites are not the best way to do research in this area. I don't recall the V8's, the WRC or F1 using this approach when they made their decisions to go down the control tyre routes.

The other question I have is - Given they have been around for 8 years, can Rallycorp show me how they have grown the Australian Rally Championship? How many more sponsors are there now? What extra merchandise is available and what are the sales like? How has the internet coverage been improved, how does it compare to other websites like the WRC, V8's or BRCC for instance? How has the TV coverage changed from 1999 to now? etc etc You've had 8 years afterall......

It might also be worth pointing out that Mr Ashton has a 37% stake in Rallycorp according to the rally.com.au website.

I'd also like to see definative evidence of the revenue they have supposedly returned to the sport not just the lip service amounts which are redisbursed to pay Rallycorp related expenses by CAMS

[sheps]

Originally Posted by Steve Ashton

I would like to put a few facts on the table about this issue as it seems people are becoming confused about the process.
1 there is NO deal in place with any tyre supplier, nor has anything been discussed in any detail with any tyre supplier. Steve Ashton, Chairman, Rallycorp.

Is there a tyre supplier who may have been given the beliefe that they will have sole supply for the 2008 ARC? maybe Pirelli?

[Ric Cary]

Originally Posted by sheps

Is there a tyre supplier who may have been given the beliefe that they will have sole supply for the 2008 ARC? maybe Pirelli?

Of Course not Steve, how could you think such a thing Steve Ashton has told us it was all open and above board and nobody had done any deals with anybody about anything, anytime, anywhere

[Martino]

Looking over the answers for the survey. The only options I can see are ones which agree with a control tyre.

RallySport Magazine: Majority in favour of control tyre for ARC

Well that Democary in action, we do have a choice as long as we mostly agree with the power above.

[MikeW]

I assume that Toyota and Ford would need to use the control tyre at Rally Australia because it's a round of the manufacturers championship.

How competitive would they be against the PWRC guys running on PWRC spec tyres?

[Kaptainballistik]

We miss the point, It isnt about us competing (Do they actually care about the backmarkers?)

Its about Making money. Pure and simple.

I will only accept this as a good idea if Tyres become cheaper. I was hoping to do some of the ARC in 2009 so it actually matters to me what they decide. ( Like Im going to be in outright contention)

Not like Ive got a morgage....

And what about Legend.. If he had to run a control tyre in the State championship, Are they going to let him use Dunlop steer tyres If (say) Pirelli gets the Contract????

Oh I forgot, There are only 8 cars in the ARC Well , Thats all they ever show, I would be felling pretty ripped about that!

Get some TV and Media exposure, Promote the sport and Put a rally near some major population. Why do to think rallying is over the top in Ireland and Scandinavia?

Not picking on Canberra, But you dont quite have 5 million people !

[sheps]

Originally Posted by Steve Ashton

Rallycorp then arranged for on line surveys to be conducted, one with the registered competitors, and one for any interested person. The results of these surveys are on rally.com.au. Steve Ashton, Chairman, Rallycorp.

How do you know only registered ARC competitors have done the servey?

As i did it and i am not registered, and i could not see the option of not having one at all..

[Ric Cary]

Originally Posted by Kaptainballistik

Promote the sport and Put a rally near some major population. Why do to think rallying is over the top in Ireland and Scandinavia?

You were going like a house on fire till right about now I have been to 2 of the three Scandinavian Rallies and let me tell you Karlstadt and Hagfors ( Sweden) make Canbraa look like a bustleing metropolis, Hamar ( Norway) whilst a much nicer place than the previous 2 is still no major population centre. the major population story is a furphy if the events are properly promoted spectators will travel ( maybe not from Canbra) and stay in accomodation unbelievable distances from the stages the promotion is the key

[Ric Cary]

Originally Posted by sheps

How do you know only registered ARC competitors have done the servey?

As i did it and i am not registered, and i could not see the option of not having one at all..

Steve you would come under "interested persons" I can't believe there was no " I don't think a control tyre is a good idea" box, must have been an oversight

[Kaptainballistik]

I just remember that Rallywales was sparsely spectated . The superspecial stage was pretty well attended.

Now For the Monte..... People were literally walking through the countryside. They came and went from nowhere!

There was also people from The bordering countries (The spain VS Italy chanting was pretty funny, So was the Tree climbing contests, But Ill digress on that.....)

The Monte was in the middle of nowhere, and people had Obviously traveled over 250km to get there! So yes Methinks on hindsight ye be correct!

But you have a Point, Put on a show and they will come. Just put a rally nearby first to wet their appetite .

With a Superspecial stage at a Sydney stadium carpark. The 1st Sydney ARC round with the Superspecial at the Container terminal went well (Spectator wise, I was shoing them out of cars....) The Eastern creek Super special just was not promoted!

[MikeW]

Originally Posted by Kaptainballistik

I
With a Superspecial stage at a Sydney stadium carpark.

Just have it in the stadium with the rally proper out at Lithgow or Hampton. It's only 2 hours from one to the other and with the M4 right there it's an easy drive. You have the SSS, overnight parc ferme and service at the stadium and a remote service near the forest for during the day.