Proposed Format for NSW Rally's in 2010

[Mike Cherry]

This has been posted on the NSW RAP site:


NSWRAP would like to advance some ideas for NSW State events for 2010, one plan could be to have very different events for state and clubman events.

State events to be all daylight, all pacenoted, max stage distance of 150 kms. Pace noting to be done on Friday, rally Saturday, go home Sunday.

Assuming the same events run in 2010 as this year, how does this affect the events.

Lithgow - no change in format, change schedule?

Bega - long weekend would suit format.

Myall stages - uses notes, change schedule?

Batmans Bay - ????

Nat Cap - ????

Coffs - probably would be this format in 2010?

Standard note writing, 2 passes over each stage, if stages were repeated, much easier on the crews?

Road book option as well? Possible different awards for crews not running pace notes?

Clubman series to be blind events, with max 20% of stage distance in daylight with 80% night stages, max stage distance 130 kms. Events would start in afternoon on Saturday, compete in night, go home Sunday.

Assuming same events for 2010, but change would mean no combined events.

Lithgow - only a state event.

Taree - OK

Canberra - OK

Port - OK

Myall stages - added as combined event this year, not next??

Oberon - ????

Car eligibility as in 2009, but driver eligibility to be determined by seeding coefficient from nsw list, to be .92 or .90 or below.
Driver grading not to be taken into account.
Seeding point to be determined at start of year and eligibility stays for the year.

RAP is looking for discussion and feedback from crews and event organisers, and a good place would be the Wauchope forum in August.

Use the contact section of this website to leave feedback.

Ray






I am personally in favour of most of this as it stands.
The format for each series is pretty much right, however, I would like to see no restrictions on gradings/seedings/vehicle eligibility for the Clubman series, there is sufficient difference in the format of events, just let the Competitors decided which they would like to do.
This would solve the problem of combined Clubman & Regional series events having graded drivers not eligible for Clubman.
The same applies for Club's that wish to run series events, they can decide which level they wish to be involved in.
We would then have a clearly defined State & Clubman series.
State events could add an "All comers" if they wish.

[Shabby]

Change for the sake of change? I think I'm going drifting.

[mattj]

yay... more time needed off work.. more $$$ for recce every time... and no night time rallying!... soft.. keep em blind...

[JS]

Originally Posted by mattj

yay... more time needed off work.. more $$$ for recce every time... and no night time rallying!... soft.. keep em blind...

Spot On... there is a good balance now with a pace noted round at Lithgow. We need to be encouraging people to run the state series not turning more away. The balance is right now. It just isn't going to get support.

Where was/is the consultation in this process. ?

John Stilling

[Troy]

I think this is the consultation. It doesnt say it is set in stone.
Personally I dont like the proposal either, but it is only a suggestion at this stage.

[gloworm]

Originally Posted by mattj

yay... more time needed off work.. more $$$ for recce every time... and no night time rallying!... soft.. keep em blind...

Agree completely Matt.

I am a definate back marker, but enjoy running a couple of state rounds during the year because of the events they are. (ie Bay Stages/Nat Cap - Steve usually runs Bega)

I am not confident with pace notes and have the choice now of not running the few pace noted events, but still get to experience state level events.

I believe changing to the proposed format, will further restrict new competitors to the sport, and in effect will do more harm than good.

Didn't State and Clubman (some events anyway) combine again this year, due to the low number of entries?

Kelly

[Marcus]

Oh geez, pacenotes on Friday?

Look I am a BIG fan of notes - and I think the state series should be notes AND I am looking forward to Myall Lakes in August - but I am struggling just to get to a bloody khanacross on Sunday, let alone a rally due to work committments.

And no night? BLECH!

Clubman - that's not that bad. But I would like to see at least one event as a piggyback to state where there can be expeience with notes. However I dotn think that'll fly if the stateproposal stands - which it shouldnt.

Frankly Lithgow or Myall Lakes is the best compromise of noting and time. Friday for most of us is just not doable and will hit the state series badly.

It is good tho this is been put up as a discussion and not a fait complete. THAT gets a big tick. I'm sure this thread is being read by the RAP so there's m y feedback

[Mike Cherry]

Pacenotes at State events are not compulsory, roadbooks still need to be produced for noting, that won't be an issue.
As far as when noting takes place, y'all now have an opportunity to have your say, but I'm sure Fridays just won't work for most events/competitors.
Some clear definition, instead of duplication, may just entice some back to the sport and Clubman would then become the ideal place to start.

[Spac]

Originally Posted by RAP website

Clubman series to be blind events, with max 20% of stage distance in daylight with 80% night stages, max stage distance 130 kms. Events would start in afternoon on Saturday, compete in night, go home Sunday.

I think the last sentence has some merit, and I strongly agree that CM should be road-booked rather than pace noted. The rest of it offends.

Why limit the maximum number of kms? Clubman level cars, driven at clubman speed are much cheaper to run (per km) than the state level cars - most CM competitors want the maximum number of kms for their dollars. If adopted, this would reduce their value for money.

In the more general sense, we're seeing a worldwide push toward events that aren't built to a formula - talk of night stages in the WRC and ARC, the popularity of the Alpine, etc etc.

It seems quite odd that the NSW RAP seems to be going in the opposite direction.

[Nigel]

For context - I'm a newbie who's been naving in the ACT series this year (plan is to drive next year).

State events definitely need a roadbook option for those of us who are new to the sport, or can’t get the Friday off work for recce. Separate awards would be good. My first event was Lithgow this year and we were on the roadbook - pace notes were a massive advantage. Even just one award for fastest crew on the roadbook would give us backmarkers something to aim for. I think state competitors deserve to have their event clearly differentiated from clubman (or the ACT series for that matter) – if I was paying $200 more I would too. One question, with separate events will you get the numbers????

Originally Posted by Mike Cherry

Clubman series to be blind events, with max 20% of stage distance in daylight with 80% night stages, max stage distance 130 kms. Events would start in afternoon on Saturday, compete in night, go home Sunday.

That sounds great - except the maximum distance bit! Less expense is good - when your a newbie still building a car/or acquiring all the safety gear, every $ counts.

Thumbs up to NSWRAP for having the balls to post this for comment.

Nigel.

[Mike Cherry]

Actually Nige, I lifted it off their website.

[Kaptainballistik]

Well, That it has to be 20% day 80% night is just plain stupid. There goes any Canberra event.

Ohh yes, lets start Narooma at 4pm........ It doent HAVE to be anything.

And to save costs I compete and THEN drive home. ( Especially on Canberra events)

( And the keen readers will remember that I LIKE driving in the night)

130km max stage distance? Are you on the trots? Max price yes....No mention of that!

Throwing more rules isnt the answer, Capping costs is. If an event director wants you to carry soft toys ...so be it.

[Nigel]

Originally Posted by Mike Cherry

Actually Nige, I lifted it off their website.

Thumbs up to you then Mr Cherry!

[Mike Cherry]

No need to really, the time frame that an event could be reasonably expected to run within is more likely to be an overriding factor.
Some events, depending on the amount of transport required, would be able to offer more than others, but that is just the way it goes.

Absolutely.

That is the basis of my arguments/suggestions.

We now have an excellent opportunity to convince them otherwise, ya?

[Mike Cherry]

Ta. Considering the "lack of publicity" surrounding this proposed RAP meeting at Wauchope, I considered it in our best interests to get it out there & get some views happening.