2009 Alpine Rally

[Swill]

Originally Posted by grahamthompson

In order to add some flesh to a more comprehensive story I am drafting on the event, can Alpine watchers please throw light on what happened to the following competitors?

Brett Middleton penalised 89 min on SS23

Darren Snooks late some 14 min on SS3, then 24 min on SS9

Jack Monkhouse penalised 40 min on SS6

Reason for Lee Garioch's DNF in the Cyborg

Both Brian Semmens' and Alan Friend's extra 8 min on SS15 (bitumen to Buchan)

Those specifics aside, I would appreciate tit-bits about any crew and their experiences that may add to the record. PM me if that is convenient.

Brett Middleton overshot and got beached and 1km in to the stage

I believe Brian Semmens is responsable for the big marks on the road and off it on the tar stage. Looked like a real good spin/loss

[pvda]

Originally Posted by Swill

I believe Brian Semmens is responsable for the big marks on the road and off it on the tar stage. Looked like a real good spin/loss

The quick right / slow left combo that caught Ty & Tara out had a ripper set of black marks (which wasn't theirs) plus signs of several cars using the gravel verge running wide on the left hander. Not sure if it's the same skid mark as mentioned above though.

[pvda]

Oops Double posted.........

[Mooa42]

Pretty sure the marks weren't Brians; story I got was that 1k from the end of SS15 Catalytic converter internals decided to pivot 90 degrees and blocked the exhaust, they could only idle to the finish and back to service.

Those looking for pics quite a few have been uploaded to the below site with more to come I am told. Some good progression shots too.

Leeding Edge Photography : Cars : Rally Cars

[razoo]

Originally Posted by Spac

Nope, oversteer on a slight right hander, clipped tree with the rear quater on my side just after he'd picked 4th.
Whoops, obviously this is Anna, not Spac!

er thanks Anna

[Daveee]

Far from perfect... but I have copy and pasted the Alpine results into an Excel file and added in stage rankings. It's probably got a fair few mistakes in it so the stage rankings won't be 100%, but will give a pretty good indication.

If anyone feels like fixing/updating the file a bit, feel free. Maybe someone could add in outright positions after each stage. (Although the way I have copy and pasted the times in may not suit that).

[PeterO]

Originally Posted by grahamthompson

In order to add some flesh to a more comprehensive story I am drafting on the event, can Alpine watchers please throw light on what happened to the following competitors?

Brett Middleton penalised 89 min on SS23

Darren Snooks late some 14 min on SS3, then 24 min on SS9

Jack Monkhouse penalised 40 min on SS6

Reason for Lee Garioch's DNF in the Cyborg

Both Brian Semmens' and Alan Friend's extra 8 min on SS15 (bitumen to Buchan)

Those specifics aside, I would appreciate tit-bits about any crew and their experiences that may add to the record. PM me if that is convenient.

Darren first suffered from what appeared to be fuel vaporisation, though that has vener happened before.
Second long time was the main lead breaking off the back of the alternator - presumable the terminal broke.

Brian's long time was when the guts of the Catalytic Converter [we have them down here] came loose and turned sideways in the case effectively blocking it. Co-driver had to push up the last hill to/out of control as not enough motive power was available.

I think the spin marks were Portmans!!!!! [judging by his victory address]

Peter

[Spac]

Originally Posted by Spac

Not calling shenanigans just yet, but something seems amiss.

Either I really don't understand the scoring, or Shenanigans.

Trying to make sense of things:
We used some late time into the long service before the tarmac, some late time out of that service, and some late time leaving the following service.

It appears that this late time has been added to our stage times.

Is that what's supposed to happen?!

There's also some other, smaller amounts of late time added in, that I have NFI about.

Regardless, our stage times put us in 52nd place, which is far less disturbing that the 63rd we've been credited with (remembering that there's a half an hour difference in those 11 places!).


Also, congratulations to GT and Winton for winning SS6, and for winning it by 59 seconds!

[Swill]

Originally Posted by PeterO

I think the spin marks were Portmans!!!!! [judging by his victory address]

Your right Pete, I'd forgot about his speach. I remember those marks pretty clearly. Luck was on his side as he was flying to set that time and have a major loose.

[PeterO]

Originally Posted by Spac

Either I really don't understand the scoring, or Shenanigans.

Trying to make sense of things:
We used some late time into the long service before the tarmac, some late time out of that service, and some late time leaving the following service.

It appears that this late time has been added to our stage times.

Is that what's supposed to happen?!

The scores would be consistent with you dropping out of late time when exiting the Service at Buchan [after the bitumen]. You were thus out of late time form there on as you did not choose to "book in early" at a control and thus get back inside late time. Penalties in accordance with Supp Regs/Furthers are thus applied.

If you check Middleton's scores, he got at 49.56ML indicating he was out of late time at that control by 9:56 (added to 40 maximum. he was still 9:56 late at the next control, but then got a 6:00 E penalty as he booked in early BUT got back inside late time, so accrued no more late penalties.

Having dropped 2 minutes outside late time [apparently] your scores on all subsequent controls will be 2:00 minutes more than they would otherwise be. SO if you took 9:10 for a stage, you are scored as 11:10L. It is even worse if you at 10:00 minutes outside late time - 10:00 minutes is added to each time.

In an event scored in a standard fashion, you would be deemed to have missed all those controls, and be amongst the "missed xx controls" group. You need to keep very accurate track of late time to see if you need to incur the early penalty to get back inside late time. Remember late time for each division was only about 30 minutes.

When you got to the Bitumen start control - where the first hold-up of the night was - did the co-driver walk/run up to control and book in on time? That is another way some people lose late time without realising.

Peter

[tortfeaser]

Originally Posted by Spac

Either I really don't understand the scoring, or Shenanigans.

Trying to make sense of things:
We used some late time into the long service before the tarmac, some late time out of that service, and some late time leaving the following service.

It appears that this late time has been added to our stage times.

Is that what's supposed to happen?!

There's also some other, smaller amounts of late time added in, that I have NFI about.

Regardless, our stage times put us in 52nd place, which is far less disturbing that the 63rd we've been credited with (remembering that there's a half an hour difference in those 11 places!).


Also, congratulations to GT and Winton for winning SS6, and for winning it by 59 seconds!

If you used late time in excess of the late time available for the division then the additional amount is added to your score as late time penalties. Say you booked in 15 mins late at one control, then 18 mins late at the next, and there was only 30 mins late time for that division, then you would accrue 3 mins in penalties, but you wouldn't be excluded for going OLT.

[HOOP]

So sorry to all the competitors who had to transport the tarmac stage because of my crash ! Its not what i had planned and im so glad we being Tara and myself wer'nt badly injured! Thankyou for your patience and understanding for us as safety was paramount to our unfortunate and good bad luck! I personally thank all the competitors for your understanding for our accident your frustation for not competing the stage is still waging war on my mind !
Regards
Ty Hooper

[tortfeaser]

And the sooner all events go A to A (or A to B, my preference for the former) consistently across the country, the better. And not just for the competitors, it seemed to me that the controls pretty much did what they wanted with no consistency across the event at all. And that's my major beef with what otherwise was a tops event.

[jamar]

Originally Posted by HOOP

So sorry to all the competitors who had to transport the tarmac stage because of my crash ! Its not what i had planned and im so glad we being Tara and myself wer'nt badly injured! Thankyou for your patience and understanding for us as safety was paramount to our unfortunate and good bad luck! I personally thank all the competitors for your understanding for our accident your frustation for not competing the stage is still waging war on my mind !
Regards
Ty Hooper

Glad to hear you were both ok (within reason)... thats the main thing...

now get back in the shed and make that thing look (and sound) as good as it did again

Cheers,

J

[Annatastic]

Originally Posted by tortfeaser

If you used late time in excess of the late time available for the division then the additional amount is added to your score as late time penalties. Say you booked in 15 mins late at one control, then 18 mins late at the next, and there was only 30 mins late time for that division, then you would accrue 3 mins in penalties, but you wouldn't be excluded for going OLT.

Spac here...

We didn't go over our late time, AFAIK - and we definitely didn't go 30 minutes over.