Celica Technical questions

[jeremymarsh]

ok folks I have a few questions for people who are also running 1970's series Toyota Celica's.

I'm currently building one up to compete in rally/motorkhana etc events and I am looking for a bit of direction in setting the car up so far I have these things

Have
The car 1974 TA22 Celica stripped down to bare bones to get a full cage fitted.
2TGEU 1.6L twin overhead cam engine with twin 40mm webers
Stock T50 5 speed manual gearbox
Stock diff with Drum rears
Roof vent
Front custom strut brace
Corona RT132 Front struts that will have Hilux Callipers and Pug rotors (is this allowed ?)

Need advice on
Steering - RnP conversion using the rack out of a AE71 Corolla - Good idea ?
Seats ? so many brands and types I just want a medium range beginner seats
TerraTrip or like - best place to get these ?
Suspension - I have been told coil overs are the go but not sure if they are approved ?
Headset radio system - these seem to be the go to talk between nav and driver but not sure what to get.
Full Roll Cage - I have been told to go see Rod Kilby and he has quoted me $2500 installed with side intrusion bars which sounds pretty good - will this be his design or something made up on the spot ?

Anything I have forgotten ? (bar fire ext, triangles, first aid)

I'm trying to get the best beginner setup at the moment as I have not done any rallying before and this car will be used for my first time out.
So any ideas on upgrades that work best and places and people to see who know there way around these cars would be great.


In fact any help from anybody would be good as this is all new territory for me.

Also i will post up some pictures of the car as it goes along this is what it looked like when i got it...



Cheers

Jeremy

[Matt Dyne]

TA22...my first car. I still have soft spot for them.

Brakes are legal...you can do whatever you like.

Rack and pinion was the subject of some eligibility issues...if you did a search, you might find something.

Seats...find what you fit into and can afford. Standard ones work until you get cranky with bouncing around.

Ebay seems to be a pretty good source of these things. I'd stay away from buying new unless you're flush with cash...alternatively www.rallynuts.com and www.demon-tweeks.co.uk have reasonable pricing. Glenn's business www.motorsportbits.com is a local rallying business...worth supporting.

Shocks are free as long as they use the factory Celica mounts. In your case, coilovers at the front is fine, but you'd have to stay with coil springs and shocks for the rear.

Kilby cages are priced the best...and he does good work. A very worthwhile investment.

Then you need the little mandatory things like triangles, first aid kit, log book etc.

Geoff used to run one that ended up with Molly Taylor (I think) and he's probably got some specific advice once you've got it up and running.

M

[erin]

Give Ian Wilson a call 0412 688 698. He runs one and has built a couple of them. You won't find anyone that knows more about them than him.

[jeremymarsh]

Can do though if you have an email address that would be good too

cheers

JEremy

[speedracer]

The sky is the limit , just need to work out your budget and go from there.

I've got one and its a ton a fun to drive .. And the best bit ... its not a Nissan
OH WHAT A FEELING

[jeremymarsh]

I reckon i love these cars i had to many at one stage and the wife made me get rid of them.....

[Brett Wright]

There is a cheap Celica for sale on my105.com. It might be worth a look.

[Spac]

Originally Posted by jeremymarsh

Corona RT132 Front struts that will have Hilux Callipers and Pug rotors (is this allowed ?)

Yes. As Matt said, suspension is free. The simple version of the rules is that if it moves up and down realtive to the body, then it can be changed. If it's part of the body/crossmemmber, then it cannot be changed.

Originally Posted by jeremymarsh

Steering - RnP conversion using the rack out of a AE71 Corolla - Good idea ?

Of questionable legality - the ex-Geoff Stewart, now-Molly Taylor car had this mod, and was questioned. It was referred to CAMS eligibility committee, but I think it went nowhere because the car was returned to a steering box, as it kicked-back less (Molly isn't exactly built like a brick sheethouse...).

Originally Posted by jeremymarsh

Seats ? so many brands and types I just want a medium range beginner seats

Buy whatever you can scrounge up. They can't be reclining, but a standard seat with some carefully applied weld or a bolt through the mech is OK.
If you're buying new race seats, either get cheapy ones (~$550/pair) or good ones (~$2000/pair). The stuff in the middle typically represents poor value, IMO.
Second hand is the go, and can occasionally be found cheaply from a ricer who has discovered they're a PITA.

Originally Posted by jeremymarsh

TerraTrip or like - best place to get these ?

We're getting ripped off for these in Aust... I'm all for supporting local suppliers, but not stupidly so... Follow Matt's links...

Originally Posted by jeremymarsh

Suspension - I have been told coil overs are the go but not sure if they are approved ?

As above - if it goes up and down, and bolts into the original spots, then it's OK.

Originally Posted by jeremymarsh

Headset radio system - these seem to be the go to talk between nav and driver but not sure what to get.

Cheapest option is a "Speak-EZ" from Dick Smith - about $30. They're designed for motorbike rider - pillion use, but work OK of you're on a tight budget.
Other option is a Terraphone - again, they're ridiculously over-priced through the official channels in this country.

Originally Posted by jeremymarsh

Full Roll Cage - I have been told to go see Rod Kilby and he has quoted me $2500 installed with side intrusion bars which sounds pretty good - will this be his design or something made up on the spot ?

I'm not sure I understand the question... If he's made one for a TA22 before (he has - he built the one for Geoff's car), then he'll probably have a template, but otherwise it will be a 'custom' job... Doesn't matter either way - he's built enough rollcages that it'll be right straight away.
Rod's typically the cheapest and does very good work, but it may also be worth speaking to Phil Donohue (his wife, Cathy, is on these forums with the username "PCD").

Originally Posted by jeremymarsh

Anything I have forgotten ? (bar fire ext, triangles, first aid)

I'm trying to get the best beginner setup at the moment as I have not done any rallying before and this car will be used for my first time out.
So any ideas on upgrades that work best and places and people to see who know there way around these cars would be great.

You're on the right track. The next thing to do is to come to a club meeting (there's one on tonight - 7:30pm at the Weston Club) and havea chat. Going to a rally and hanging around the service park is also worthwhile (except the next rally is NatCap, and I'm sure Bogan will hit you up to official!).

[DaveTrees]

Originally Posted by Spac

They can't be reclining, but a standard seat with some carefully applied weld or a bolt through the mech is OK.

Actually, if you use the standard seats, they can be reclining .... only replacement front seats have to comply with Schedule C requirements - see 3.10(i) of the PRC rules

[jeremymarsh]

Brett Wright

Thanks for that have contacted them its always good to have a spare at that price its to good to pass up.

Spac

Coilovers -Thats very helpful already from what i know so far that means the coil overs are out as i need to make new saddles to fit them.
Steering - Looks like i will keep the original steering for the time being...
Seats -Will keep my eye out for a pair (pm'd bogan about a couple if the sale fall's through)
Cage - Rod Kilby seems to be the go i used to deal with Phil Donohue's dad Stan i'm pretty sure (same last name) so he might be a good idea as well.
Headset - will stop by dick smith on the way home for a gander.

I wish i could get to the meeting tonight but im helping plan the Marques in the Park display for the Canberra Celica Group Tonight.

I have done some road closures for Rally of Canberra bu would be more than happy to help at other events as long as im free.

The other fairly important question i have is Sponsors how does one approch them and work out a fair deal ?

Cheers

Jeremy

[jeremymarsh]

Originally Posted by DaveTrees

Actually, if you use the standard seats, they can be reclining .... only replacement front seats have to comply with Schedule C requirements - see 3.10(i) of the PRC rules

Hmm interesting but the standard seats are fairly poor and are broken from old age fairly regulary.

[razoo]

Originally Posted by jeremymarsh

I reckon i love these cars i had to many at one stage and the wife made me get rid of them.....

rotflmao

I can just get away with the rally car parked in the yard; it's the piles of tyres she objects to. "Why do you need so many?"

Geoff

[fro]

Originally Posted by Matt Dyne

Rack and pinion was the subject of some eligibility issues...if you did a search, you might find something.

Check the latest ARCom minutes as well: Article 8.3 to be exact.

[Spac]

Originally Posted by jeremymarsh

...that means the coil overs are out as i need to make new saddles to fit them.

Ah, and here's where the simple version fails us both... On the front, coil overs are definitely OK - I'd say that about 50% of cars use 'em - and those that don't mostly wish they did.... Adjustable/rose jointed/billet/whatever strut tops are also OK.
The actual wording is:

(v)The top mounting points of MacPherson struts are free save the the mounting points on the actual bodywork must remain unchanged

(vi)....The spring seats may be made adjustable, even if it includes the addition of material

On the rear, coil-over shocks are not OK, but if you wish to make the rear spring height adjustable, then that's legal.

Originally Posted by jeremymarsh

The other fairly important question i have is Sponsors how does one approch them and work out a fair deal ?

Most sponsorship/signage you see on rally cars is the car owner's own business - or at least their partner's or friend's business...don't go thinking that every sticker means $2000/year, because it just doesn't happen...
Similarly, many stickers are there because the business has given the car's owner cost price on some bits, maybe some free labour and knows the car's owner will be coming back again and again.

Having said that, it's worth trying.
You can just go with the splatter approach, and send out a zillion letters and you'll probably get some sort of response, but you're far better off targetting potential sponsors and working out what you can offer them in return - and making sure you tell them that.
Eg: A dentist's surgery or a supermarket isn't really going to get any benefit from you fanging around in the bush with their name on your car, but a new mechanical garage that specialises in modifying cars probably will.
The challenge is finding the business that can see the benefit, has the money, and isn't already sponsoring someone else.

[jeremymarsh]

From the above pdf

"PRC Steering Racks

No Feedback has been received regarding the allowing or disallowing of a steering rack and pinion replacing a steering box. ARCom resolved that there be no change to the effect of the existing regulation, though some work should be undertaken to improve the wording to ensure the correct interpretation."

What does this mean ?

Spac

Much help you are with all this info should be up and rallying (& crashing) in no time keep the comments rolling people the more info the better...

Cheers

Jeremy